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Lenny's Podcast / episode intelligence

Building minimum lovable products, stories from WeWork and Airbnb, and thriving as a PM | Jiaona Zhang (Webflow, WeWork, Airbnb, Dropbox)

2 Jul 2023 24 published claims 2 attributable people

Speakers in the public record

Claim mix

belief 8recommendation 4uncertainty 4evaluation 4preference 3prediction 1

Evidence policy

Every row below preserves an exact excerpt. Identified speakers are linked; unresolved voices are labeled and excluded from people counts.

Claim ledger

The useful parts, with receipts.

24 published records

01 / recommendation

Likes The Design Sprint.

“I love the Design Sprint by Google. I also really Julie's book around managing people how to be a good manager. That one's really great. And so those are my more business side of the house books. And then we can also talk about fantasy stuff if you want. But-”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

04 / belief

I think we should have known that or we should have dug into that more at the very beginning and then to get very tailored instead of one blunt instrument to solve it all, "Hey, we're going to go inspect.

“I think we should have known that or we should have dug into that more at the very beginning and then to get very tailored instead of one blunt instrument to solve it all, "Hey, we're going to go inspect.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

05 / uncertainty

Definitely everyone on my direct team and definitely everyone on the leadership team, so call it those two combined were maybe, I don't know, like 20 or so people, 25 people.

“Definitely everyone on my direct team and definitely everyone on the leadership team, so call it those two combined were maybe, I don't know, like 20 or so people, 25 people.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

06 / uncertainty

I don't know if there's one thing, but it's almost like every day I'm thinking about small tweaks and process to make all of us more efficient.

“I don't know if there's one thing, but it's almost like every day I'm thinking about small tweaks and process to make all of us more efficient.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

07 / belief

How long it takes for the thing to sync is a big part of the experience of using Dropbox. And so I think that is a big, big learning where it's really understanding that would've shifted your investments into doing that performance work as opposed to chasing the competitive space.

“How long it takes for the thing to sync is a big part of the experience of using Dropbox. And so I think that is a big, big learning where it's really understanding that would've shifted your investments into doing that performance work as opposed to chasing the competitive space.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

08 / uncertainty

Very recently, so have been investing in a couple of new features, memberships and logic, new functionality for our users. And what we realized at the end of the day after investing in these areas, we were like, "Hey, we can get to minimal viable, but we don't know if we can actually get to minimal lovable in a way that our users really, really want.

“Very recently, so have been investing in a couple of new features, memberships and logic, new functionality for our users. And what we realized at the end of the day after investing in these areas, we were like, "Hey, we can get to minimal viable, but we don't know if we can actually get to minimal lovable in a way that our users really, really want.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

09 / belief

Funny story, I think I literally had a board meeting the day before I went in for a checkup, and then in the checkup they're like, "You're in labor.

“Funny story, I think I literally had a board meeting the day before I went in for a checkup, and then in the checkup they're like, "You're in labor.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

11 / belief

Much of what I just heard is you just worked incredibly hard and just got shit done. And I think that's very, very important and often leads to a lot of success.

“Much of what I just heard is you just worked incredibly hard and just got shit done. And I think that's very, very important and often leads to a lot of success.”
Speaker
Lenny Rachitsky
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

12 / belief

I remember talking to one of our colleagues, Mike Lewis, who was leading a different team with Airbnb, and he was just like, "Oh, I realized I'm the person that should be saying, 'No, we shouldn't do this now'" because he was the head of product for one of the new [inaudible 00:14:09].

“I remember talking to one of our colleagues, Mike Lewis, who was leading a different team with Airbnb, and he was just like, "Oh, I realized I'm the person that should be saying, 'No, we shouldn't do this now'" because he was the head of product for one of the new [inaudible 00:14:09].”
Speaker
Lenny Rachitsky
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

13 / uncertainty

One is Airbnb and Brian and many great leaders are famous for imagining the ideal situation, imagining the great end result and then working backwards. And often that leads to great results when you're being really ambitious and "I don't know how we're going to get there, we're just going to shoot big and hopefully we figure it out.

“One is Airbnb and Brian and many great leaders are famous for imagining the ideal situation, imagining the great end result and then working backwards. And often that leads to great results when you're being really ambitious and "I don't know how we're going to get there, we're just going to shoot big and hopefully we figure it out.”
Speaker
Lenny Rachitsky
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

14 / belief

Making that onboarding journey for the host and then discovery journey and guest booking journey really, really great. So I think that that same lesson when applied to Airbnb, would've in my head changed the way we invested and I think we would've gotten more returns, as opposed to spreading ourselves and then having things that sort of work but then didn't quite work.

“Making that onboarding journey for the host and then discovery journey and guest booking journey really, really great. So I think that that same lesson when applied to Airbnb, would've in my head changed the way we invested and I think we would've gotten more returns, as opposed to spreading ourselves and then having things that sort of work but then didn't quite work.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

15 / recommendation

You could be known for working on the most technically complex problems, find something that you can be really, really good at. And the reason I give that advice is because when you do that, you can crush the projects that you get because you're making a name for yourself, reputation, and then you are giving more responsibility.

“You could be known for working on the most technically complex problems, find something that you can be really, really good at. And the reason I give that advice is because when you do that, you can crush the projects that you get because you're making a name for yourself, reputation, and then you are giving more responsibility.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

17 / preference

I think every team takes it and tweaks it a little bit, but I'm a big believer of bringing those artifacts back and then sharing them across the team. And so product operations is also a function that we've invested in because it just really greases the wheels, gets all of our teams speaking the same language.

“I think every team takes it and tweaks it a little bit, but I'm a big believer of bringing those artifacts back and then sharing them across the team. And so product operations is also a function that we've invested in because it just really greases the wheels, gets all of our teams speaking the same language.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

18 / preference

I love... It's not recent, but I do love the SNOO and it's very top of mind because I just graduated my second son from the SNOO and it was a little bit like, "Oh my gosh, no more rocking of the baby.

“I love... It's not recent, but I do love the SNOO and it's very top of mind because I just graduated my second son from the SNOO and it was a little bit like, "Oh my gosh, no more rocking of the baby.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

19 / evaluation

I think the hardest memory was, this gets a little bit personal, but I was actually in my first trimester when we were going through all of these layoffs and I basically was faced with a choice.

“I think the hardest memory was, this gets a little bit personal, but I was actually in my first trimester when we were going through all of these layoffs and I basically was faced with a choice.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

20 / evaluation

Yeah, I'm a big fan of docs and decks are obviously helpful if you're talking live, but I do think in a remote-first culture or lots of us are in hybrid remote cultures it's hard because decks typically require a voiceover.

“Yeah, I'm a big fan of docs and decks are obviously helpful if you're talking live, but I do think in a remote-first culture or lots of us are in hybrid remote cultures it's hard because decks typically require a voiceover.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

21 / recommendation

It's very difficult to learn the product in the first 90 days, especially if I was also prioritizing all these conversations with the team. And so I think that again, without the time constraint, what I would recommend is to be like, "Hey, every product leader has to take the time to really go deep on the product.

“It's very difficult to learn the product in the first 90 days, especially if I was also prioritizing all these conversations with the team. And so I think that again, without the time constraint, what I would recommend is to be like, "Hey, every product leader has to take the time to really go deep on the product.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

22 / evaluation

" And it was a very, very small team and it had a very, very tight deadline. So when you're like, "I can do something like this," you end up getting more responsibility because people were like, "Oh, she was able to do something that was really hard with a small team," and so that's how you get more responsibility.

“" And it was a very, very small team and it had a very, very tight deadline. So when you're like, "I can do something like this," you end up getting more responsibility because people were like, "Oh, she was able to do something that was really hard with a small team," and so that's how you get more responsibility.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

23 / prediction

It was a lot of learning. And I think probably a lot of people, even right now through the macroeconomic downturn, they're learning that lesson in a really hard way.

“It was a lot of learning. And I think probably a lot of people, even right now through the macroeconomic downturn, they're learning that lesson in a really hard way.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

24 / preference

Because I definitely don't want a culture where it's like you took a risk and you failed and therefore your performance is impacted.

“Because I definitely don't want a culture where it's like you took a risk and you failed and therefore your performance is impacted.”
Speaker
Jiaona Zhang
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast
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