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Lex Fridman Podcast / episode intelligence

#464 – Dave Smith: Israel, Ukraine, Epstein, Mossad, Conspiracies & Antisemitism

9 Apr 2025 56 published claims 2 attributable people
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Speakers in the public record

Dave SmithLex Fridman

Claim mix

belief 35evaluation 9uncertainty 5commitment 4preference 2observation 1

Evidence policy

Every row below preserves an exact excerpt. Identified speakers are linked; unresolved voices are labeled and excluded from people counts.

Claim ledger

The useful parts, with receipts.

56 published records

01 / evaluation

He had this strategy of propping up Hamas for years. And so he had this strategy of propping up Hamas for a myriad of reasons, but a major part of it was that, “Look, man, as long as there’s terrorists in power there, there’s never going to be any pressure on us to give the Palestinians a state, because look, are you telling me I got to negotiate with them?

“He had this strategy of propping up Hamas for years. And so he had this strategy of propping up Hamas for a myriad of reasons, but a major part of it was that, “Look, man, as long as there’s terrorists in power there, there’s never going to be any pressure on us to give the Palestinians a state, because look, are you telling me I got to negotiate with them?”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

02 / belief

I also think that’s something that people get a little bit wrong when they think, “Okay, this guy was CIA, or, “This guy was Mossad.” And then there’s also, I think there’s the possibility that there are rogue elements within those organizations.

“I also think that’s something that people get a little bit wrong when they think, “Okay, this guy was CIA, or, “This guy was Mossad.” And then there’s also, I think there’s the possibility that there are rogue elements within those organizations.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

04 / uncertainty

At least there’s another guy who thought there’s a chance that it might be a good idea. Because I don’t know, that’s the cool thing about the things we do, you’ve been through a lot of battles, you’ve walked into a lot of tough debates and it’s like you don’t know, this could be the conversation that ends you.

“At least there’s another guy who thought there’s a chance that it might be a good idea. Because I don’t know, that’s the cool thing about the things we do, you’ve been through a lot of battles, you’ve walked into a lot of tough debates and it’s like you don’t know, this could be the conversation that ends you.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

05 / uncertainty

There’s other things that are factors too. But the fact is that you have… I mean, I don’t know to look over the numbers for the whole history of the conflict, but the amount killed by the Israelis on the Palestinian side, versus the amount killed by the Palestinians is 20 to 1 in Israel’s killing more people, maybe more than that, I don’t know exactly, I’d have to look at the numbers.

“There’s other things that are factors too. But the fact is that you have… I mean, I don’t know to look over the numbers for the whole history of the conflict, but the amount killed by the Israelis on the Palestinian side, versus the amount killed by the Palestinians is 20 to 1 in Israel’s killing more people, maybe more than that, I don’t know exactly, I’d have to look at the numbers.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

06 / belief

Yeah, no, I agree with that. And I’m sure I’m not without my own bias in this because from my own self-interested perspective, I’m not saying this is the main reason to be annoyed with them or anything like that, but what I personally get is all types of, “Self-hating Jew,” “Nazi apologist,” all this literally just because I criticize the way Israel’s conducting this war.

“Yeah, no, I agree with that. And I’m sure I’m not without my own bias in this because from my own self-interested perspective, I’m not saying this is the main reason to be annoyed with them or anything like that, but what I personally get is all types of, “Self-hating Jew,” “Nazi apologist,” all this literally just because I criticize the way Israel’s conducting this war.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

09 / belief

I think also there are shows, there are people, that just are constantly conspiracy theorists, which is fine also, but I sometimes feel that those lack genuineness, because they put themselves in a bin.

“I think also there are shows, there are people, that just are constantly conspiracy theorists, which is fine also, but I sometimes feel that those lack genuineness, because they put themselves in a bin.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

11 / commitment

You can only lie so much before eventually nobody wants to hear you in that phony voice telling the same phony lies anymore. And at least Jon Stewart is, I will say, I think Jon Stewart is telling the truth the way he sees it.

“You can only lie so much before eventually nobody wants to hear you in that phony voice telling the same phony lies anymore. And at least Jon Stewart is, I will say, I think Jon Stewart is telling the truth the way he sees it.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

13 / uncertainty

I think that the… Personally, I think… And I don’t know if I say this for not necessarily the Arab world, but at least the nation states, their governments, I think are pretty much there.

“I think that the… Personally, I think… And I don’t know if I say this for not necessarily the Arab world, but at least the nation states, their governments, I think are pretty much there.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

14 / belief

I think maybe that might be the best thing that came out of that Oval Office thing, is that maybe that Donald Trump is going to be very tough to do business like this, and it’s like we shouldn’t be doing this business deal anyway.

“I think maybe that might be the best thing that came out of that Oval Office thing, is that maybe that Donald Trump is going to be very tough to do business like this, and it’s like we shouldn’t be doing this business deal anyway.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

15 / belief

I don’t see anyone right now who I think could be that person, but I never would’ve … I mean, if you had asked me in 2014 who’s going to come take over the Republican Party, I never would’ve guessed Donald Trump was going to come do what he did.

“I don’t see anyone right now who I think could be that person, but I never would’ve … I mean, if you had asked me in 2014 who’s going to come take over the Republican Party, I never would’ve guessed Donald Trump was going to come do what he did.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

17 / belief

I think also the Democratic Party has learned a lesson of you have to have candidates that do … I don’t give a shit about podcasts, but do podcasts-like things, meaning reveal themselves as human beings.

“I think also the Democratic Party has learned a lesson of you have to have candidates that do … I don’t give a shit about podcasts, but do podcasts-like things, meaning reveal themselves as human beings.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

18 / belief

I think he was way ahead of his time in really calling out the corruption in DC and I think that’s one of the things, it’s a common through line between the Federal Reserve and government spending, and of course this crazy war industry that our country has.

“I think he was way ahead of his time in really calling out the corruption in DC and I think that’s one of the things, it’s a common through line between the Federal Reserve and government spending, and of course this crazy war industry that our country has.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

19 / belief

I think the problem with that is just, again… I don’t mean to be cruel about this, because it sucks that there’s little countries that are next to big countries that get bullied around about them, but there also is a bit of an entitlement to demanding a security guarantee.

“I think the problem with that is just, again… I don’t mean to be cruel about this, because it sucks that there’s little countries that are next to big countries that get bullied around about them, but there also is a bit of an entitlement to demanding a security guarantee.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

20 / commitment

If that was the concern, then the response would be, “We need some type of Manhattan Project.” And I’m not supporting a government project here, but there would be, “We need some type of Manhattan Project to say, ‘We are going to make these things here.

“If that was the concern, then the response would be, “We need some type of Manhattan Project.” And I’m not supporting a government project here, but there would be, “We need some type of Manhattan Project to say, ‘We are going to make these things here.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

21 / belief

There weren’t these accusations of Euro war criminal or something like that. But what he said, what Jonah Goldberg agreed with, I think the statement was every 10 years or so, America’s got to find a puny little country and put them up against the wall just to let the rest of the world know that we mean business.

“There weren’t these accusations of Euro war criminal or something like that. But what he said, what Jonah Goldberg agreed with, I think the statement was every 10 years or so, America’s got to find a puny little country and put them up against the wall just to let the rest of the world know that we mean business.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

23 / belief

I think something that’s a little bit foreign, no pun intended, to America is, we’ve fought in a lot of wars over the last, say, 25 years, 50 years, whatever.

“I think something that’s a little bit foreign, no pun intended, to America is, we’ve fought in a lot of wars over the last, say, 25 years, 50 years, whatever.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

24 / belief

Maybe I’d just go after him or something. But I could understand, and I think most people who have kids could understand going to a level of the most evil dark place you could imagine if anyone ever threatened or actually did something to your kids.

“Maybe I’d just go after him or something. But I could understand, and I think most people who have kids could understand going to a level of the most evil dark place you could imagine if anyone ever threatened or actually did something to your kids.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

25 / belief

If we think we can just go around the world killing people, propping up dictatorships, putting our military bases in the Muslims holy land and not engender hatred from that, then we do that at our own peril.

“If we think we can just go around the world killing people, propping up dictatorships, putting our military bases in the Muslims holy land and not engender hatred from that, then we do that at our own peril.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

27 / uncertainty

Oh, yeah, I’ve been gradually growing in popularity over the past 10 years, I’ve been doing interviews, lectures, podcasts, and it’s actually very gradual. And I don’t know what else to say.

“Oh, yeah, I’ve been gradually growing in popularity over the past 10 years, I’ve been doing interviews, lectures, podcasts, and it’s actually very gradual. And I don’t know what else to say.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

28 / belief

Listen, whether you’re talking about the neoconservatives or going way before the neo… Any other group that has ever had control of US foreign policy, going back to the Cold Warriors, the Truman administration, the Eisenhower administration, I think you could take this back to Thomas Jefferson if this happened in 1801, there is simply no way that they would allow a foreign great power to overthrow their government, and then bring our neighbor into their military alliance.

“Listen, whether you’re talking about the neoconservatives or going way before the neo… Any other group that has ever had control of US foreign policy, going back to the Cold Warriors, the Truman administration, the Eisenhower administration, I think you could take this back to Thomas Jefferson if this happened in 1801, there is simply no way that they would allow a foreign great power to overthrow their government, and then bring our neighbor into their military alliance.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

29 / belief

I mean, okay, I don’t 100% disagree with you, but I think if I were to say the degree to which that matters… At a murder trial after somebody’s been convicted and before sentencing, sometimes the judge will allow them to give a statement.

“I mean, okay, I don’t 100% disagree with you, but I think if I were to say the degree to which that matters… At a murder trial after somebody’s been convicted and before sentencing, sometimes the judge will allow them to give a statement.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

31 / belief

Really, World War II and the Civil Rights Movement, I think are the third rails of American politics, if you have any type of view that is not the approved authorized view of how these events went, you’re in a lot of trouble.

“Really, World War II and the Civil Rights Movement, I think are the third rails of American politics, if you have any type of view that is not the approved authorized view of how these events went, you’re in a lot of trouble.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

32 / belief

I never would’ve envisioned Elon Musk was going to get $44 billion together and buy Twitter and then he was … And so I just think that if you zoom out, I think that the regime has lost their monopoly on propaganda, and this opens up enormous possibilities for what … I remember so vividly, 2002.

“I never would’ve envisioned Elon Musk was going to get $44 billion together and buy Twitter and then he was … And so I just think that if you zoom out, I think that the regime has lost their monopoly on propaganda, and this opens up enormous possibilities for what … I remember so vividly, 2002.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

33 / belief

First of all, thank you for the encouragement. But to push back on the complexity of it a little bit, I think everything you said about your life is also true about my life except family, I want to have a family, you son of a bitch, you’re bragging.

“First of all, thank you for the encouragement. But to push back on the complexity of it a little bit, I think everything you said about your life is also true about my life except family, I want to have a family, you son of a bitch, you’re bragging.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

34 / belief

I think that the part of the awful thing of always using World War II as the next example for the next war is that it’s almost like you’re never… They hate us for our freedom, or Vladimir Putin’s just mad and he wants to reconstitute the Soviet Union.

“I think that the part of the awful thing of always using World War II as the next example for the next war is that it’s almost like you’re never… They hate us for our freedom, or Vladimir Putin’s just mad and he wants to reconstitute the Soviet Union.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

35 / belief

I think there’s a certain drug to the dogmatic certainty that you were mentioning. It really annoys me, there’s something about human psychology, because when I say stuff, I usually show doubt and show the humiliated that I might not have the right answer and I sometimes look at multiple perspectives.

“I think there’s a certain drug to the dogmatic certainty that you were mentioning. It really annoys me, there’s something about human psychology, because when I say stuff, I usually show doubt and show the humiliated that I might not have the right answer and I sometimes look at multiple perspectives.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

36 / belief

I think the broader point you’re making, I mean, there’s just a lot of trivialization of the World War II that happens in the West, in the United States especially.

“I think the broader point you’re making, I mean, there’s just a lot of trivialization of the World War II that happens in the West, in the United States especially.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

37 / belief

I think that there’s often almost shortcuts that are presented before you, but there is a payoff to not taking the shortcuts and to doing it the way you want to do it.

“I think that there’s often almost shortcuts that are presented before you, but there is a payoff to not taking the shortcuts and to doing it the way you want to do it.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

38 / belief

I think we got to this discussion from the military industrial complex and military intervention, and Ron Paul, before that, if you could rewind a little bit.

“I think we got to this discussion from the military industrial complex and military intervention, and Ron Paul, before that, if you could rewind a little bit.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

40 / belief

I really have trust that Darryl will handle this responsibly. And in fact, I think that he might be… And not because he’s involved, this is his angle or what he’s attempting to do.

“I really have trust that Darryl will handle this responsibly. And in fact, I think that he might be… And not because he’s involved, this is his angle or what he’s attempting to do.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

41 / belief

I think legitimately that statement, removing the trolling from it, is the revisionist history statement that I think is wrong, and the invasion of the Soviet Union would’ve happened no matter what.

“I think legitimately that statement, removing the trolling from it, is the revisionist history statement that I think is wrong, and the invasion of the Soviet Union would’ve happened no matter what.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

44 / uncertainty

There’s such a difference in perspective because if somebody just found me and they just found out who I am, and they go, “This guy’s brand new and he’s doing all these shows,” but you’re like, “Yeah, well, I don’t know, dude.

“There’s such a difference in perspective because if somebody just found me and they just found out who I am, and they go, “This guy’s brand new and he’s doing all these shows,” but you’re like, “Yeah, well, I don’t know, dude.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

46 / belief

Just like, fuck it. And he has that whole vibe, which kind of looks effortless, but I think when you look at it seriously, especially in contrast with journalists, there’s a fearlessness there.

“Just like, fuck it. And he has that whole vibe, which kind of looks effortless, but I think when you look at it seriously, especially in contrast with journalists, there’s a fearlessness there.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

47 / evaluation

” You know what I mean? But the point is, the Zionist settlers, and they spoke about this openly, they all knew they had a major problem, which is like, “Well, you can’t create a Jewish state if it’s 50/50,” which is… And in all of Israel, it was much less than 50/50, but even in the Israeli portion of the partition recommendation, it was very close to 50/50.

“” You know what I mean? But the point is, the Zionist settlers, and they spoke about this openly, they all knew they had a major problem, which is like, “Well, you can’t create a Jewish state if it’s 50/50,” which is… And in all of Israel, it was much less than 50/50, but even in the Israeli portion of the partition recommendation, it was very close to 50/50.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

48 / evaluation

Talking to some comedian about his thoughts on all this stuff is a very different thing than talking to a world leader and especially one who’s conducting a brutal war as you’re talking to them. And I don’t know exactly what the way to navigate that is.

“Talking to some comedian about his thoughts on all this stuff is a very different thing than talking to a world leader and especially one who’s conducting a brutal war as you’re talking to them. And I don’t know exactly what the way to navigate that is.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

49 / evaluation

I was arguing with one guy on a podcast, and he said that, he goes, “You can’t allow dictators to have nuclear weapons because they might use them.

“I was arguing with one guy on a podcast, and he said that, he goes, “You can’t allow dictators to have nuclear weapons because they might use them.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

50 / evaluation

96% of the people are innocent who get killed, but they call them targeted drone bombings. And Al-Qaeda and the Arabian Peninsula just kept getting bigger and bigger because every time you go in there, it’s like, okay, you took out one target and then you took out three little girls.

“96% of the people are innocent who get killed, but they call them targeted drone bombings. And Al-Qaeda and the Arabian Peninsula just kept getting bigger and bigger because every time you go in there, it’s like, okay, you took out one target and then you took out three little girls.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

52 / evaluation

I’m just saying in all of these situations, you always kind of got to separate, what are legitimate grievances and what are, okay, you’re wrong on that and you shouldn’t be doing that. So it’s pretty easy for me, if I listen to the Putin interview with Tucker, I thought his whole 30 minute opening thing was horrible and just kind of stupid, especially when you’re talking to Tucker Carlson.

“I’m just saying in all of these situations, you always kind of got to separate, what are legitimate grievances and what are, okay, you’re wrong on that and you shouldn’t be doing that. So it’s pretty easy for me, if I listen to the Putin interview with Tucker, I thought his whole 30 minute opening thing was horrible and just kind of stupid, especially when you’re talking to Tucker Carlson.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

54 / evaluation

He was like, “This is the worst thing we could possibly do after the fall of the Soviet Union, to now say that we had this alliance in NATO that was an anti-Russian military alliance, and now that the Soviet Union isn’t there anymore, and it’s Boris Yeltsin’s Russia, that now we’re going to expand NATO because of that.

“He was like, “This is the worst thing we could possibly do after the fall of the Soviet Union, to now say that we had this alliance in NATO that was an anti-Russian military alliance, and now that the Soviet Union isn’t there anymore, and it’s Boris Yeltsin’s Russia, that now we’re going to expand NATO because of that.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

55 / preference

In fact, one of the reasons I stay away from that discussion of Israel, which I think is nuanced and really complicated in the way that we’ve been discussing, in order to have an intellectual exploration of ideas, you have to be able to misstep and try ideas for size.

“In fact, one of the reasons I stay away from that discussion of Israel, which I think is nuanced and really complicated in the way that we’ve been discussing, in order to have an intellectual exploration of ideas, you have to be able to misstep and try ideas for size.”
Speaker
Lex Fridman
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast

56 / evaluation

”. And the last thing I’ll say is that it’s freaking crazy, because he’s got more shit going on than anybody else in the world and is still very interested to take time out to discuss some thing that I’m asking him about, which is a really, really great quality.

“”. And the last thing I’ll say is that it’s freaking crazy, because he’s got more shit going on than anybody else in the world and is still very interested to take time out to discuss some thing that I’m asking him about, which is a really, really great quality.”
Speaker
Dave Smith
Publisher
Lex Fridman Podcast
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