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Lenny's Podcast / episode intelligence

Anthropic’s CPO on what comes next | Mike Krieger (co-founder of Instagram)

5 Jun 2025 15 published claims 2 attributable people
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Speakers in the public record

Lenny RachitskyMike Krieger

Claim mix

evaluation 6belief 3preference 2prediction 2uncertainty 1recommendation 1

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Claim ledger

The useful parts, with receipts.

15 published records

01 / uncertainty

You guys launched MCP, which is just, I don't know, the fastest growing standard of any time in history that everyone's adopting Claude powered and unlocked centrally the fastest growing companies in the world, Cursor, Lovable, and Bolt, and all these guys.

“You guys launched MCP, which is just, I don't know, the fastest growing standard of any time in history that everyone's adopting Claude powered and unlocked centrally the fastest growing companies in the world, Cursor, Lovable, and Bolt, and all these guys.”
Speaker
Lenny Rachitsky
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

02 / belief

I think overall though, and maybe this is tied into the earlier question on competition and differentiation, and it actually goes all the way back to the Artifact conversation, which is like I think you know when your product is really serving people and it's doing a good job of doing that, and I think so much of when you get really metrics obsessed is when you're trying to convince yourself that it is when it's not.

“I think overall though, and maybe this is tied into the earlier question on competition and differentiation, and it actually goes all the way back to the Artifact conversation, which is like I think you know when your product is really serving people and it's doing a good job of doing that, and I think so much of when you get really metrics obsessed is when you're trying to convince yourself that it is when it's not.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

04 / evaluation

There was a bit of like I told you so which sure anything launching you could be like, "This is not going to work." And you're right, most of the time most things don't work.

“There was a bit of like I told you so which sure anything launching you could be like, "This is not going to work." And you're right, most of the time most things don't work.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

05 / belief

I think more of them will get created with some things like our new models, but the reason that that's an interesting space to occupy is do something that feels very advanced user, very power user, very weird and out there at the beginning, but could become huge if the models make that easy.

“I think more of them will get created with some things like our new models, but the reason that that's an interesting space to occupy is do something that feels very advanced user, very power user, very weird and out there at the beginning, but could become huge if the models make that easy.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

06 / preference

Not in a chatbot sense, but in a true collaborator sense. So long answer to your question, but I think we have to first get Claude to be a great conversationalist so that it understands when it's appropriate to engage and to get more information.

“Not in a chatbot sense, but in a true collaborator sense. So long answer to your question, but I think we have to first get Claude to be a great conversationalist so that it understands when it's appropriate to engage and to get more information.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

07 / evaluation

There was an engineer lead that shared 90% of your code roughly is written by AI now, which first of all is just insane that it went from zero to 90%, I don't know, a few years, something like that.

“There was an engineer lead that shared 90% of your code roughly is written by AI now, which first of all is just insane that it went from zero to 90%, I don't know, a few years, something like that.”
Speaker
Lenny Rachitsky
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

09 / evaluation

" We ran a much broader early access program with these models than we had in the past, and part of that was because there's this real, we can hill climb on these evaluations and talk about suite bench and towel bench and terminal bench, whatever, but customers ultimately know Cursor bench which doesn't exist other than in their usage and their own testing et cetera is the thing that we ultimately need to serve.

“" We ran a much broader early access program with these models than we had in the past, and part of that was because there's this real, we can hill climb on these evaluations and talk about suite bench and towel bench and terminal bench, whatever, but customers ultimately know Cursor bench which doesn't exist other than in their usage and their own testing et cetera is the thing that we ultimately need to serve.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

10 / preference

Most of the rest of Anthropic is written in Python, some Go, some Rust now, but we're not like a TypeScript shop. And so I saw a great comment yesterday in our Slack where somebody had this thing that was driving them crazy about Claude Code and they're like, "Well, I don't know any TypeScript, I'm just going to talk to Claude about it and do it.

“Most of the rest of Anthropic is written in Python, some Go, some Rust now, but we're not like a TypeScript shop. And so I saw a great comment yesterday in our Slack where somebody had this thing that was driving them crazy about Claude Code and they're like, "Well, I don't know any TypeScript, I'm just going to talk to Claude about it and do it.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

11 / recommendation

I find what comes out of that ends up being quite different than what my intuitions would've been for a good prompt. And so I'd encourage folks to also check that out even for their own use cases because while that tool is met for an API developer putting a prompt into their product, it's equally applicable for a person doing a prompt for themselves.

“I find what comes out of that ends up being quite different than what my intuitions would've been for a good prompt. And so I'd encourage folks to also check that out even for their own use cases because while that tool is met for an API developer putting a prompt into their product, it's equally applicable for a person doing a prompt for themselves.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

12 / prediction

I think things that are going to, I can't promise this as a five to 10 year thing, but at least one to three years, things that feel defensible or durable.

“I think things that are going to, I can't promise this as a five to 10 year thing, but at least one to three years, things that feel defensible or durable.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

13 / evaluation

" And the answer can't just be we'll ask Claude, all right, well, we could do this experiment, we could have this thing. So I think nurturing curiosity and still having a sense of, I don't know, the scientific process sounds grandiose to instill in a 6-year-old, but that process of discovery and asking questions and then systematically working right through, I think will still be important.

“" And the answer can't just be we'll ask Claude, all right, well, we could do this experiment, we could have this thing. So I think nurturing curiosity and still having a sense of, I don't know, the scientific process sounds grandiose to instill in a 6-year-old, but that process of discovery and asking questions and then systematically working right through, I think will still be important.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

14 / prediction

And I think for the worst in a lot of ways because I think we're still holding on some assumptions. So I think the roles are still fairly similar, although we'll now get in my favorite things that happen now are some nice PMs that have an idea that they want to express or designers that have an idea they want to express will use Claude and maybe even Artifacts to put together an actual functional demo.

“And I think for the worst in a lot of ways because I think we're still holding on some assumptions. So I think the roles are still fairly similar, although we'll now get in my favorite things that happen now are some nice PMs that have an idea that they want to express or designers that have an idea they want to express will use Claude and maybe even Artifacts to put together an actual functional demo.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

15 / evaluation

" And I could see people's eyes going, "What did I sign up for and why am I hearing this school auditorium hearing about information theory?" But he did a really nice job I think of also just imagining there will be different jobs and we don't know what those jobs are going to be and so what are the skills and techniques and remain open mindedness around what the exact way we recombine those things.

“" And I could see people's eyes going, "What did I sign up for and why am I hearing this school auditorium hearing about information theory?" But he did a really nice job I think of also just imagining there will be different jobs and we don't know what those jobs are going to be and so what are the skills and techniques and remain open mindedness around what the exact way we recombine those things.”
Speaker
Mike Krieger
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast
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