Evidence receipt / belief
Published · transcript-backedTyler Cowen: belief
6 Sept 2023 Conversations with Tyler Jerusalem Demsas on The Dispossessed, Gulliver's Travels, and Of Boys and Men
“Both come home empty-handed, as I think I mentioned before, and neither seems happy at the end.”
Source trail
Everything needed to verify it.
- Speaker
- Tyler Cowen
- Attribution
- Verified speaker
- Claim type
- belief
- Recorded
- 6 Sept 2023
- Publisher
- Conversations with Tyler
Transcript context
…I think maybe part of it is, in both of these novels, these men would not be happy anywhere in any context. Maybe that’s part of what’s going on here, is that there’s not a society that would make Shevek happy. When he’s amongst the communitarians, he’s frustrated by the strictures they put upon him, but also, he’s frustrated when his friend critiques them, and he’s angry at him, and they get into a big fight over it. Then Gulliver — everywhere he goes, he has some critique. At one place he doesn’t is a place where he’s treated terribly, and it’s unsustainable for him to stay there, and you can’t actually imagine him providing anything of use to that world. He’s literally just an oddity that gets pushed out every once in a while, like at these dinner parties. To me, it’s an indictment of this sort of traveling in order to find yourself or find something important or true because in many ways, Gulliver does not end up more enlightened by the end of the book. Shevek ends up right back where he was. His entire goals when he was moving there seemed naive in hindsight. I think that’s maybe slightly a little bit too much in The Dispossessed world because we know later on that his connections end up being the foundation for a really important technology that connects space, different planets. But at the same time, what was the point? [laughs] Still, Shevek and Gulliver — they’re the two people who know things that no one else knows. Even reading about it, you can’t really understand what it was like, and it’s raising the question: The ancient Greeks on “knowledge is everything” — how true is that really? What does it get you? What does it get anyone else? What does it get your spouse? Both come home empty-handed, as I think I mentioned before, and neither seems happy at the end. But they had to do it, perhaps. I question whether they needed to travel to get the knowledge, because Shevek is really pushed out of his framework of viewing his own society as utopian by a friend who has this realization, never travels, is within that community the entire time. He just witnesses his own inability to get his own research done. He witnesses a childhood friend of theirs get sent to an insane asylum because he’s ridiculed after he does a subversive musical performance or theater performance. To me, that knowledge was there. You’re obviously a big proponent of travel but — [laughter]…
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