Bob Moesta: belief

Transcript context

…Yeah, I get that. You mentioned that there's two different approaches or many different approaches to the Jobs to Be Done framework, and this is a question someone actually asked that there's maybe a framework by someone named Tony Ulwick, and then there's your approach, and then maybe Clay Christensen maybe has an approach. So can you just help clarify? So Clay and I collaborated on it. So I was lucky enough to have Clay as a mentor for 27 years, I met with him once a quarter for 27 years, and at some point I shared with him the hack of how I was thinking about this and what I was doing, and at some point he said, "We need to turn it into a theory." To me, it was more like my work around because I couldn't read and write, "Let me go talk to some people, I'll figure it out." And ultimately we turned it into a method. So if you look at Competing Against Luck, it was written with Tady Hall and Karen Dillon, Dave Duncan, but I helped on that book for 16 months. Some of the clients in there are my clients. I think Intercom is in that one. So Clay and I are aligned in that. Clay was more about turning it to a theory and I would say I'm more about having it be a method. So his is like a thinking framework and a philosophy and a strategic kind of frame where mine is very tactical about how do we get it and then what do we do with it. Ulwick's comes from a very different perspective, and again, I think it's very valuable, but it comes from the notion of functions and it's more like, what can our product do? What jobs can our product do? As opposed to the way I look at it is basically only people have jobs, products don't have jobs, people have jobs, organizations don't have jobs, people in organizations have jobs because that's the irrational part. And so fundamentally there's that two different views of how do we look at it, but ultimately I would say Clay's approach and my approach are derived from the same dataset where Ulwick's is derived from a different dataset and a different set of experiences. That's super interesting, I had no idea about this. And your sense is in the case of Twitter, for example, maybe it's closer to Clay's just think about it approach.…

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