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3 May 2026 Lenny's Podcast Why cultivating agency matters more than cultivating skills in the AI era | Max Schoening (Head of Product, Notion)
“The one thing I will say that I've noticed is specifically for designers, the designers that I think have, at least in software design, high taste are the ones that both have side projects that they build where they're responsible of the full thing and extent.”
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Everything needed to verify it.
- Speaker
- Max Schoening
- Attribution
- Verified speaker
- Claim type
- commitment
- Recorded
- 3 May 2026
- Publisher
- Lenny's Podcast
Transcript context
…It's so funny. That's exactly how agents learn and develop how, as you said, models learn just like doing the thing, seeing was this good, was this correct? No. Okay, learn. So it's just doing the thing, learning, getting feedback, and there's no way to speed around this. This is why often people with the best taste have been doing this for a long time. The one thing I will say that I've noticed is specifically for designers, the designers that I think have, at least in software design, high taste are the ones that both have side projects that they build where they're responsible of the full thing and extent. And they're also always tinkering with some new app. They're the annoying person that is like, "Hey, what if we tried this in our team?" And I'm like, "Really, this is the 49th time that you suggested in a tool. Do we really need this?" It's exposure to other people's ideas. I think that is the ... It's also really important to surround yourself with tasteful things so that you feel like the thing you are making is lacking. One of the things we do at Notion is all of our conference rooms are named after famous objects like The first typewriter, the Macintosh, a Porsche 911 and so on. And so inevitably when I'm sitting in one of the rooms and I pay attention to the room, nothing I'm doing amounts to this. I got to do better. You've built so many successful, great, loved products. What do you think matters in the end to building a successful product if you had to just boil it down?…
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