Evidence receipt / belief
Published · transcript-backedJeff Dean: belief
12 Feb 2025 Dwarkesh Podcast Jeff Dean & Noam Shazeer — 25 years at Google: from PageRank to AGI
“You don't really care. But I think as you scale up, there may be a push to have a bit more asynchrony in our systems than we have now because we can make it work, our ML researchers have been really happy how far we've been able to push synchronous training because it is an easier mental model to understand.”
Source trail
Everything needed to verify it.
- Speaker
- Jeff Dean
- Attribution
- Verified speaker
- Claim type
- belief
- Recorded
- 12 Feb 2025
- Publisher
- Dwarkesh Podcast
Transcript context
…-web crawler messing up, and there were a lot of people streaming the Super Bowl at the same time. The thing that led us to go from asynchronous training on CPUs to fully synchronous training is the fact that we have these super fast TPU hardware chips and pods, which have incredible amounts of bandwidth between the chips in a pod. Then, scaling beyond that, we have really good data center networks and even cross-metro area networks that enable us to scale to many, many pods in multiple metro areas for our largest training runs. We can do that fully synchronously. As Noam said, as long as the gradient accumulation and communication of the parameters across metro areas happens fast enough relative to the step time, you're golden. You don't really care. But I think as you scale up, there may be a push to have a bit more asynchrony in our systems than we have now because we can make it work, our ML researchers have been really happy how far we've been able to push synchronous training because it is an easier mental model to understand. You just have your algorithm sort of fighting you, rather than the asynchrony and the algorithm kind of battling you. As you scale up, there are more things fighting you. That's the problem with scaling, that you don't always know what it is that's fighting you. Is it the fact that you've pushed quantization a little too far in some place or another? Or is it your data?…
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