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21 May 2023 Lenny's Podcast Lessons from scaling Spotify: The science of product, taking risky bets, and how AI is already impacting the future of music | Gustav Söderström (Co-President, CPO, and CTO at Spotify)

“Gustav Söderström I think so. In almost all industries, you have this smiling curve concept, where you want to be at the extremes on the smiling curve, and that's where big business opportunities are but not in the middle.”

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Speaker unverified
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Not verified from this transcript
Claim type
evaluation
Recorded
21 May 2023
Publisher
Lenny's Podcast

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…This episode is brought to you by Eco. Last month, Eco users earned an average of $84 in cashback rewards. How? With Eco, the future of personal finance. Eco is the update to a misaligned financial system. Providing an app that works just like your bank but removes almost all of the middleman, helping even the best money optimizers optimize in less time automatically. What if you earn rewards for paying your rent or got rewarded for ordering food and shopping online or even earn rewards for saving each month? And then imagine if you got rewarded again just for getting rewarded. With Eco, you can spend at some of your favorite merchants and automatically get 5% cashback, plus Eco's APY rewards look more like $80, not 80 cents. And then there are Eco points, the world's first open reward system. You earn them whenever you do almost anything in the Eco app. Eco is working to make these points the most rewarding points ever. So it pays to be early. Sound too good to be true? Go to eco.com/lenny, sign up for an onboarding and find out why it isn't. Lenny's Podcast listeners who attend an Eco welcome session will get an exclusive 4% APY on deposits over $1,000. Learn more at eco.com/lenny, that's E-C-O.com/lenny. It's interesting these two examples you gave, Apple and Amazon, they're two of the biggest companies in the world and they're like at the extremes of these two into the spectrum. And it's interesting, most companies are somewhere in the middle. I wonder if there's just a benefit to being in an extreme and that ends up being really important. Gustav Söderström I think so. In almost all industries, you have this smiling curve concept, where you want to be at the extremes on the smiling curve, and that's where big business opportunities are but not in the middle. So it's probably true in terms of organizational models as well. Speaking of extremes, I want to talk a bit about taking big bets. So you guys had this big launch event recently where you basically redesigned the whole primary feed of Spotify to make it feel more like where apps are going, like TikTok reels feel of just stream, and you start hearing videos and music starts playing and some people loved it, some people did not. And I'm curious as a product leader, how you think about thinking long term and dealing with people that are just like, "What the hell's ... I hate change, stop changing things." How do you think about that? Who do you listen to? Who do you ignore? How do you know to stay the course? How do you approach that?…

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