Evidence receipt / belief
Published · transcript-backedLenny Rachitsky: belief
3 May 2026 Lenny's Podcast Why cultivating agency matters more than cultivating skills in the AI era | Max Schoening (Head of Product, Notion)
“I've gone in the meetings the same way I've done it. I think that makes a lot of sense.”
Source trail
Everything needed to verify it.
- Speaker
- Lenny Rachitsky
- Attribution
- Verified speaker
- Claim type
- belief
- Recorded
- 3 May 2026
- Publisher
- Lenny's Podcast
Transcript context
…To be fair, I do understand why companies do that, which is I am surprised by how much work it takes to get people to identify the outer loop of their work and enlist an agent and build the ... I don't know. The term right now is like factory, like the software factory for the work that they do. It is surprising to me how much prodding you need to do to get people out of the way they're used to working. And so if you're dealing with tens of thousands of people at the scale of Meta, I have some sympathy for, okay, a good way to do this is just start a leaderboard and encourage people to do it. They will find good things and useful things to do with that as they learn. Yeah. It's such a good point. You have to over-index to change people's default easy behavior. I'm just going to write these periods the way I've always done it. I've gone in the meetings the same way I've done it. I think that makes a lot of sense. What have you seen actually work with a Notion to get people to significantly change the way they work? Depends on the role. So roles that are perhaps further away from engineering, actually, you don't have to convince them all that much because they're like, "Whoa, I have superpowers now. Look at this amazing thing I've just built" because the capability gap of what they were able to do before versus after is so huge that it's intoxicating. And then you have to actually almost do the opposite, which is like, yes, but do you understand why we can't merge this PR? I think on the engineering side, something that Simon last talks about a lot is any manual intervention in code is bad. You probably did something wrong in the verifiability loop and in the software factory. This excludes obviously reviewing code. I am still very much in camp. You should probably review more code than put more effort into reviewing code than you do, but at least on the writing side, every time there is an intervention, a human intervention, it should feel a little bit like a bug. I think that's a good litmus test for how, I don't know, agent-filled you are.…
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