Julia Shaw: recommendation

Transcript context

…Can you just linger on that a bit? So how should we think about everything you just described for how our criminal justice system forgives? If they are very unlikely to murder again, how would you reform the criminal justice system? I think forgiveness is up to the victims’ families, and quite often when you speak with victims’ families, there is this divide where you have some who are much more keen on something called restorative justice, which is where they… What they want is for the person to apologize, the perpetrator to apologize, to explain how it happened. Also, quite often, I mean, you look at some of the other consequences in the other context, it’s sort of like teenage boys who are part of gangs, for example, is the other context. And it’s a teenage boy killing another teenage boy. Like, these are kids, and the parents of a teenage boy understand that. This isn’t… You know, they don’t think of this other perpetrator as this grown man who has… I don’t know. It’s… I think we think of it as this fight between the parents of both teenage boys in that case, but really, often what parents want is to just understand how this could happen and, in some ways, to allow the other teenage boy to still have a life and to not steal theirs as well, or his as well. So there’s that restorative justice model where forgiveness, I think, belongs to the families. Some families, of course, want the most extreme punishment. That’s also… I can understand how that would be a response that’s triggered if you’ve suffered a severe loss. But if we’re looking to make society safer, putting people who’ve killed in prison is actually not the answer, right? Because if we want society to be safer, it should be based purely on what is most likely to deter crime and who is most likely to engage in it, and that’s where I think we’ve got it upside down. If I could just stick to The Bad People Podcast, there’s an episode on incels called Black Pill: Are Incels Dangerous? So are they dangerous? What’s the psychology of incels?…

Stored transcript either side of the excerpt. The highlighted words are the published quote; the surrounding text is unedited source, never generated.