Recommends The Hard Thing About Hard Things. Recommends Build.

15 May 2025 Lenny's Podcast How Revolut trains world-class product managers: The “local CEO” model, raw intellect over experience, and a cultural obsession with building wow products | Dmitry Zlokazov (Head of Product)

“The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz. Actually read it quite some time ago, but I found myself recommending it to other product managers most often. It's actually illustrative that to be a great product manager, someone needs to strive to being a great CEO. And besides this book emphasizes the importance of building systematic solutions and scalable solutions, which is critical for scaling a company. Also being honest on how important it is to grind stuff. And then second book is, I read it more recently, Build by Tony Fadell. I was really inspired by this one, especially given how I appreciate how it's not easy to build hardware and what Tony was describing there is just super exciting and inspiring. And also I think that there are different archetypes of product managers. There are people who tend to disrupt things more. Personally I think about myself as a builder, so Tony's principles that he highlighted in the book that they resonate with me a lot.”

— Dmitry Zlokazov

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Speaker: Dmitry Zlokazov
Attribution: Verified speaker
Claim type: recommendation
Recorded: 15 May 2025
Publisher: Lenny's Podcast
Episode: How Revolut trains world-class product managers: The “local CEO” model, raw intellect over experience, and a cultural obsession with building wow products | Dmitry Zlokazov (Head of Product)

Transcript context

…Here we go. Okay. First question, what are two or three books that you've recommended most to other people? The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz. Actually read it quite some time ago, but I found myself recommending it to other product managers most often. It's actually illustrative that to be a great product manager, someone needs to strive to being a great CEO. And besides this book emphasizes the importance of building systematic solutions and scalable solutions, which is critical for scaling a company. Also being honest on how important it is to grind stuff. And then second book is, I read it more recently, Build by Tony Fadell. I was really inspired by this one, especially given how I appreciate how it's not easy to build hardware and what Tony was describing there is just super exciting and inspiring. And also I think that there are different archetypes of product managers. There are people who tend to disrupt things more. Personally I think about myself as a builder, so Tony's principles that he highlighted in the book that they resonate with me a lot. I'm trying to get Tony on the podcast. If anyone listening knows Tony Fadell and can nudge him, "Hey, say yes to Lenny," that'd be great. I've been in touch with his team, but he's not doing podcasts right now, but I'm trying to get him on. Okay, moving on. Do you have a favorite recent movie or TV show that you've really enjoyed?…

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